The Decemberists: California One / Youth and Beauty Brigade
[audio:https://dovesandserpents.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/10-California-One-_-Youth-and-Beauty-Brigade-3.mp3|titles=The Decemberists: California One – Youth and Beauty Brigade]
I’m in the process of choosing to leave. I’m almost there. There’s only a consideration of the cost.
I have a rich family heritage of leaving. My thoughts often turn to that great-great-grandfather who left wife and two daughters in Sweden. Just left them behind because they would not go with him to America, to await the end of the world in a safe place among the Saints. There’s a great-granduncle who left behind “a fallen prophet” to continue practicing “the Principle.” And a great-grandfather, grandson of Brigham, who, overcome with grief, just checked out-haunting the poolrooms and pubs of Salt Lake City … and haunting my mind. Leaving seemed the right choice for them. Perhaps it was even a price they felt compelled to pay?
See the example and read the admonitions of those who stay. They say staying is good; the price of leaving, too great. Though they taught me to honor the sacrifices of those who leave the world to join the Church, and though they promise that the price of what is left behind is virtually inconsequential when compared to the reward, they also say that it is those who choose to stay that should inspire us now. And so I agreed to let the mysteries of those who reject the reward remain in that box under the bed where dust bunnies play their tricks.
But then fate and I pulled out the box, chased-away the dust, and wept with those who left.
Of all the choices in life, leaving may be the hardest. By nature, we want to honor our people and traditions. We want to stay, and this wanting makes choosing to stay so much easier. I wanted to please my parents, so I chose to attend church as a child. I wanted to honor the wishes and judgment of my elders, so I chose to be baptized. I wanted to be accepted by my people, to do what is right before my God, so I chose to serve a mission and to marry in the temple. I wanted to stay; and so for much of my life I’ve chosen to stay. And this choice has been comforting.
Then the comfort went away. There’s not much left at this point but to be true to the whole story. For every member not born into the Church, leaving is at least half of the story, the most traumatic, the price they paid for the flawed pearl they now hold. It’s time to honor the memory of those who left and the full value of what they left behind. Hold it in your hands and contemplate: Were they right? Am I wrong?
Yes, I’m in the process of leaving. The threads of my faith have become as bare as the threads of my garments. Yet I still wear them. The last few threads are as steel that binds my heart to those who stay.
I have not found a reason sharp enough to cut these last threads. So I remain in the process of leaving … unwilling to pay the price asked by my great-great-grandfather’s God.
— —
Originally published in Sunstone Magazine, July 2009, under the title All That Is Left Behind. Re-published here with some revision.
[Image credit: album art – The Decemberists – Castaways and Cutouts]
I read a book about a young girl raised in a cult. Her parents joined to follow an all powerful leader before she was born – giving him all their worldly possessions to pursue a life of meditation with the Yogi. In fact, they were assigned to marry each other by the Yogi – they never loved each other. They were also instructed to NOT have sex even within marriage since the only person they were supposed to be in love with was the Yogi. When she was born, they were pleased that the Yogi had accepted her since obviously, they had had sex. The baby was called a chosen one and given special positions. The girl was assigned jobs – good jobs when she was in the Yogi’s favor and terrible ones when he was displeased. She wanted to go to school, with some manipulation she was finally given permission to go to college. She met a man at school who was outside the community. She fell in love – she kissed him once. Her brother turned her in. After years of servitude to the Yogi- this one thing caused her to be driven out of the community.
Why do I retell this story? Because odd as it seems, it paralleled my life in Mormonism. I felt like I was required to follow leadership that was corrupt and all powerful. Sometimes they liked me; sometimes they didn’t. I was told to do many many jobs and to sacrifice for the religion. If something made you uncomfortable – that was a good thing, a trial to endure. I was required to follow weird relationship etiquette in an attempt to find a certain type of partner. Even within marriage there are rules about how to operate. I went to BYU. I went on a mission. I went to singles wards. I wore what I was told to wear. I did what the church said to do. I had few friends outside the religion and would never ever date a non-member. I was within the community so much – that it wasn’t until I left that I started to look at life and the different ways people live that truly fulfill them. Finally, because of my refusal to do one more thing the Bishop required . . . I was outcast immediately, despite a lifetime of servitude.
I read the book – and realized the church is a cult. I identified with this young woman trying to make a life outside of a very controlling religion. I love my family and the good things I have experienced because I do have a real relationship with God. But I’m not willing to go back to the mind numbing drill that I have to experience to comply in Mormonism. I will never be able to squish myself back into that box. I gave up a lot to leave but I’m happy everyday to be free and I feel new to so much. I love my friends who have replaced my family. The guilt is gone. The stress is gone. My world is full.
Thank you, Angie. I’m sure you remember that time when it all seemed so normal … it was all that you knew and it was what everyone you cared for knew. And yet, it still hurt and you … and I couldn’t understand why. It was very confusing and self-doubt and self-loathing inducing. I mean, what’s wrong with me that I can’t act in ever minute of every day in accordance with my professed faith and love for God and his Church? But now I’m free of that and it’s a beautiful experience. It’s also a lonely experience and so I’m thankful for voices like yours. It’s like being in a dark room and there’s someone else who you can only hear. And the sound of that voice keeps the insane darkness at bay.
After a life of devoted Church service, temple attendance, and religious devotion, I am depressed, exhausted, and heartbroken. Learning about Joseph Smith’s polyandrous adventures, seeing the abuse of priesthood authority by so many in the Church, and seeing women abused by their stake/president/bishop/area authority husbands has left me devastated. I cannot see a parallel between the biblical Jesus, who forgave readily and loved those who were rejected by society, and our Church’s policies against women, homosexuals, sinners, and–in the past–blacks. I am appalled by the self-righteous, hero-worshipping mentality of too many Church members.
And yet I stay.
I stay because my husband and children are active. I stay because I hope for institutional change. I stay because I pray that Church leaders will become more transparent, more accountable, and more accessible. I stay because I still believe.
Thank you, Chris. I once believed that the church was unchangeable, you know, because it’s the church of a so-called “unchanging god.” When I realized that the church is just all these people and nothing more, it became clear that all the problems were mostly people problems compounded and retarded by a belief that the church and its people were channeling an unchanging, all-powerful god.
I still believe as well, it’s just that it’s only the people I have hope for … it’s the people I believe in. If you hope the church will change, I think your hope is not only meaningful but realistic. The church will change because, all dogma aside, it’s just people and people always change.
Cheers to you. Your friend in this process of leaving but staying.
I appreciate your heartfelt response, too, Chris… and, like Matt, I believe in the people, too.
Chris, your belief is a gift to your husband and children: I hope the institutional change you hope for comes soon.
Matt, I was interested to see that this post appeared in ‘Sunstone’ eighteen months ago. Is there anything you’d say about the way that you felt to change this post since then?
BTW, loved the music and image on this post. I always feel like I enter into a communicative space when I read ‘Cipher on a Wall’.
Thank you, Andy. I don’t think much has changed since then. The revisions here were mostly to restore some meaning that I’d felt was lost in the editorial process. The bit about the garment is no longer accurate but the threads of my faith are still there and the perpetual suspense is vivid as ever. It’s a bit like what Angie describes about a residual connectedness and that connectedness is something I have in common with my family-is the last vestige of something deeply personal-so it’s all the more difficult to want to leave it.
The other part in the book that was striking was the girl and how she lived her life after she left. She found herself going back to old patterns even when she was no longer required. She meditated. She praised the Yogi in her mind. She had practiced so long and all her life a certain way.
I feel like that now. I go along in life repeating scripture and quotes from the prophets in my mind as I go about my day. Then I think to myself – should I really be quoting these men? I think a lot about my mission and the hundreds of people I influenced and I hope the church is not punishing them. I think about good times; but I also freely think about all the crazy testimonies I listened to and crazy advice/blessings I was given by the priesthood. I say freely, because I used to squelch the bad so that I could tolerate church. Now I can really say 75% of what I listened to at church was rhetoric or just plain crazy. There is 25% that was really decent and spiritual. . . but the bad outweighed the good and I couldn’t fight to stay any longer. I practiced being Mormon so long – I will have a lot in common with the girl from the cult book. . . I do Mormonism without thinking. I pray, I read, I feel for the Holy Ghost when making decisions. Maybe I took the good parts with me. . . and left the bad behind when I stopped going to church?
I have to respect everyone’s path. I feel for all those who commented because it’s scary and it’s weird. . . to do something else.
Angie, I connect with what you’re saying here. It influenced what I wrote in a comment to Andy’s “Hosana in the Highest” post.
Angie, in reading this I saw myself doing the same things… the part about residual / subconscious practicing of Mormonism is really striking.
Matt, I love this. I really like you frame it within the choice of staying or leaving and your family ancestry. And I especially like how it looks within the visual of the ship and the haunted-looking people. Beautiful.
BiV, of course I owe a special thanks to you. The process is a fond memory.
I always had the feeling that you had already left, or at least decided to leave. Interesting. Is it possible to feel like one is also in the process of staying? As I don’t currently attend church, the inexplicable pull to go back feels like I will always be fighting it one way or the other. When I’m there I’m sure I’ll want to leave, but right now I want to find a way to go back. And it is not for the community. How does one manage the process without keeping one foot out, one foot in? I really dislike lack of commitment in myself, but I don’t see an alternative.
Thank you, Corktree. The Clash say “should I stay or should I go?” and that’s the kind of question that’s perpetually out there. Yet I’ve long felt that I have very little choice in the matter. I’m where I am because of who I am. Like you, I don’t see an alternative.
I’ve been listening to podcasts of the “testimonies” of the past few years of Sunstone panel’s (you can download them from links from staylds.com) and so this topic is fresh in mind.
I think I have recently left as well — I’ve left the strict confines of the literal interpretation of the symbols, but I continue to push ahead. I continue to define and claim what I believe in and express that belief in the small moments when the church structure allows me (ie. fast & testimony meeting, public prayers, etc…) I still believe in groups working together for the greater good and accept and acknowledge the sins of my father’s and my generation as being mine, so I’m not looking join or start a new group but evolve the one I’m in.
That sounds good to me, Carey. Thanks for that. We only have the people around us and I’m not sure we’d have the opportunity to change our surroundings in the same way that our ancestors were able to do. That was a rare and bitter-sweet luxury whereas the rest of human history seems to have been mostly about, as you say, evolving the group that we have.
Yes, making the decision to leave is hard because Mormonism becomes so engrained in your psyche because of the brainwashing and programming that goes on. I was born and raised Mormon by two very TBM parents. I went through Primary, Young Women and 4 years of Seminary. I went to BYU for two years. I was married in the temple. I was active and believing for many, many years.
Then in July 2001, I went on a Mormon Church History Tour. Beforehand, I decided to do some research about church history so I would know more about the details when I visited the key places. Being born and raised Mormon, I had just gone along for so many years, believing what I was taught. But at the point, I felt like I needed to know about church history on my own in order to get as much as I could out of the trip. As it turned out, that was the beginning of the end for me as I began to discover all the lies, deceptions, cover-ups and contradictions behind Mormonism. In the process of my research, it became increasingly crystal clear to me that Joseph Smith made the whole thing up — and because of his charisma and con-artist background, he was able to get a lot of people to believe and go along. How can anything good come from something that is built on lies? And so many lies. The differing versions of the First Vision and the fact that the “official” version wasn’t even written down until 1838, which was 18 years after the vision supposedly took place, and at a time when the church was losing many members due to the excommunications of Oliver Cowdery and the Whitmer brothers for opposing Joseph Smith on his practice of polygamy (so the First Vision was “beefed up” to say that Joseph Smith saw Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ whereas previously he had only said that he had seen “heavenly personages”)… the truth behind polygamy, the name Fanny Alger, and the fact that Joseph Smith had 33 wives including 11 teenage brides, in many cases behind Emma’s back and without her knowledge and/or consent (which goes against what D&C 132 outlines). . . the truth behind the supposed “martyrdom of Joseph Smith” and why he was really in Carthage Jail since in reality he was not a martyr but simply a criminal having ordered the destruction of the Nauvoo Expositor (and the burning of the building in which it was housed) after William Law and some others published a story exposing Joseph Smith’s practice of polygamy. . . the fact that Joseph Smith had a gun in Carthage and fired shots defending himself. . . the truth behind the Kirtland Bank, the financial fiasco including charges of counterfeiting, etc, etc. . .
Discovering all of this really shook my faith, so much so that when I got home from the trip, I decided to continue my research. That is when I discovered the truth behind the Book of Abraham and the fact that the papyri were simply Egyptian funeral scrolls and Joseph Smith’s “translation” of them was bogus. . . the truth behind the Book of Mormon, the anachronisms, and the strong possibility that the entire book was plagiarized, most likely from writings of Solomon Spaulding. . . the truth behind Blacks and the Priesthood, and the very real possibility that when the Blacks were given the Priesthood in 1978, it was because the Mormon Church was being threatened with getting their tax-exempt status taken away (as was the case with Bob Jones University, which did indeed get their tax-exempt status taken away in 1980 due to their discriminatory dating policy).
Because of all this, I finally came to the conclusion that I had to disassociate myself from the Mormon Church. At that point, I couldn’t fathom staying in a religion that plays so fast and loose with the truth.
Interestingly, it wasn’t until after I had already left that I discovered the practice of polyandry and the fact that Joseph Smith married 10 women who were already married to living husbands. This is in essence religiously-condoned adultery, and even went against D&C 132 in its entirety. What gave Joseph Smith the right to marry other men’s wives? What gave him the right to commit adultery in the first place? It all boils down to the fact that he was out of control and thought he could get away with anything.
I have never regretted my decision to leave the Mormon Church — and I have a very hard time understanding how anyone who knows these things could possibly stay.
Thank you, Diane. I’m fascinated by the way your de-conversion coincided with a Church History tour. I’ve been on such tours a few times but was pre-teen and pre-mission respectively so I experienced the tour in a relatively spoon-fed and believing way. At the time I think the tour made my faith seem more real and concrete, but later in life, when I ran into many of the same issues that you have, the memories of my time on the road of history also made my doubts more real and concrete.
I wonder if it might have been easier to stay had I not had such a strong foundation of literal belief.
Beautiful post Matt.
I think the church has been so woven into every aspect of my life — my family history, relationships with parents, grand-parents, friends, my husband — that I could leave the church, but it will never fully leave me, but I’m OK with that. I don’t want to erase the past, I think it is important to recognize all the good, bad and in-between that has come into my life because of the accident of being born of goodly Mormon parents.
Thank you, Heidi. It’s a beautiful point you make as well. We are who we are and there’s no escaping it.
I find your comment very interesting — “I wonder if it might have been easier to stay had I not had such a strong foundation of literal belief.” I’m very literal when it comes to my belief system, so I basically found myself befuddled at all I discovered and was incensed at the fact that I had been lied to my entire life. If I had not done research before and after the church history tour, I would not have found out what I did because of the “spoon-feeding” that goes on — and if I had continued to simply reply on that “spoon-feeding,” I probably would have stayed. I had many issues over the years, but I had put them all on a shelf, deciding that these were things I would “come to understand later on.” But once I uncovered the lies, deceptions and contradictions that abound in Mormon History, I could no longer rationalize it all out. The bottom line to me is that the Mormon Church is built on a stack of lies — and as I heard said so many times when I was growing up and an active adult, anything that is built on a shaky foundation cannot stand. But that is exactly what the base of the Mormon Church is — a very shaky foundation absolutely filled with lies. For a religion that claims to value truth, honesty and integrity, the fact that its history is so replete with lies and dishonesty is all the more astonishing.
What I find sad is that most Mormons will never know the real truth because they adhere to the admonition to not read and research anything outside of the authorized areas (which, BTW, is one of the signs of a cult). Of course, the Internet has made accessible all kinds of information that was previously somewhat difficult to find — but since most Mormons look at this information as “anti-Mormon propaganda,” the reality of actual truth behind what is found there will continue to elude most of them. But to paraphase a well-known “Mormon” scripture, “If anyone lacks wisdom, let him ask of Google.”
“If anyone lacks wisdom, let him ask of Google.” <-- love it. I think that the entire communal conversation is quickly becoming an unavoidable force for change in people's lives and thereby in the church as a whole. There's a limit to what one can reasonably demonize as "anti-mormon" and that limit is probably somewhere in the region of our closest family and friends ... and this is where the conversation for change is clearly taking place.
I’ve been surprised a few times recently to have family members and close friends say things that suggest that they think I’ve been overwhelmingly influenced by ‘anti-mormon’ sources. I suppose it’s been so long since I’ve seen writings that challenge the church in such two-dimensional and purely oppositional terms. Yet, this language seems to be an important tool for those who love me, in interpreting my story.
PS. Google may giveth to all men liberally, but it DOES upbraid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKJWJAyncyI
Or, on second thoughts, perhaps it needs upbraiding.
Oh, Andy, those google searches are just hilarious.
As a child of converts, I am completely unburdened with any history in the Church. No pioneers, no descent from great leaders, no history of any sort. Of my family, half are active, half inactive (including parental structure), so I could stay or leave with equal levels of acceptance. I have nothing to hold me other than choice, and in that I suppose I am blessed. In my case I studied all of the same material, am aware of the problems with the BoA and BoM, aware of Joseph’s clearly checkered history, and of the many injustices that have been perpetuated in the past, and likely will be in the future. In the end, however, I’ve found solace in many aspects of the Church, so I stay. The calculus might be different for others, but I wish it were otherwise.
In many ways, that simple ability to choose makes things easier. Without the burden of history I could read and study the Church without any need to view the different issues with one lens or another. I can easily recognize that Joseph Smith was an unparalleled ass at times, without trying to explain it away as anything other than the fact that he was a complete ass. I also have to conclude that he rose above what we might consider normal human experience at times as well. I fully recognize that the BoA is problematic from a genesis point of view, but I think the theology it contains is fairly deep and very interesting, and I am less interested in the origins, than in the application. The BoM is the same, but I had no ancestors to cross the ocean because of it. I can view it as a problematic text with both supporting and detracting facets, and take it as it is.
I say this because I fully understand why some people leave the Church, but I do wish it were otherwise. I have thought for a while that the LDS Church is going through some significant changes, and I think there is a positive place for the questioning believer in it, especially in the coming decades. The Catholic Church has its fair share of fundamentalists, but also of social activists and progressive thinkers. I think the LDS umbrella is growing and the Church will have to come to terms with all sorts of members, and with more and more sticking around, the process will only be accelerated.
I recognize that many people cannot find a fit within the Church, and I certainly would not recommend sticking around if this is the case. But I do hate to lose members because they cannot find a place within the ranks, when we should be doing more to open the ranks to allow everyone in. I believe the problem is exacerbated in places like Utah. But I have found a lot of hope in blogs like this one, and others online, where the stereotypes are being broken, and members can find communion with others of the same mold. I think we are all lessened when we lose people, because everyone has something to offer the Church and the membership. Likewise I think the Gospel, which is not synonymous with the Church, has something to offer everyone.
Let me reiterate, if the Church is not for you, by all means do not harm yourself by staying, but if you are on the fence, I would rather see you in, than out, if only for the company.
Wow, Yusuf Ibrahim. Thank you for sharing your thoughts here. I share them, but could not have articulated them so eloquently.
Thank you for this post, Matt. I appreciate the juxtaposition of those who stay and those who leave.
The timing of this post is incredible, since I just officially resigned my church membership on Friday. I spent about 18 months of being “in the process of leaving” before I was able to formerly cut the tie. All that slow movement towards an ultimate decision, and it wasn’t even my home tribe.
I left the Roman Catholic church in 1999 to become Mormon. In doing so, I left behind generations of faithful Irish Catholic ancestry. My religious birthright was matriarchal; it was assumed that the religion would be passed mother to daughter. As the oldest daughter, I made the unpardonable choice. As a result, my mother’s family rejected my decision. They said novenas, lighted candles, and had Masses offered in my name. They boycotted my temple wedding and my son’s baby blessing. I cannot in good conscience say that they rejected me, as I first rejected them.
Last December, I made the announcement to my family that I was leaving the LDS Church, and the fatted calf was slaughtered on my behalf. Old grievances were forgot, the Prodigal Daughter had returned. Heartfelt toasts were offered up at the Christmas party for me and my children. The question became, “When will you baptize your son?” On the other side of the family are my in-laws, asking, “Will you baptize your son?” The first question refers to an opportunity lost when my son was 8 days old. The second question refers to a future opportunity ignored, when my son turns 8 years old. What is so magical about the number 8, that we place our hopes, aspirations, and disappointments on it?
I just read Yusuf Ibrahim’s comment and am dumbfounded. I am a child of converts as well, and I don’t have any “history” in the Church other than being 10 months old when my parents joined the Mormon Church (after being tracted by missionaries). My parents are both gone now, but they were both very faithful members of the Mormon Church for many, many years. But when I began to study the rather sordid history of the Mormon Church, and then came to terms with what went on back then, taking into consideration the actions of Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and others, I could not rationalize it all out — and I wasn’t using “one lens or another” as described by Yusuf in describing his research into Church history, doctrine and teachings. In other words, I wasn’t swayed in one direction or the other by either family history or preference. I was simply struck by the number of lies, deceptions and contradictions laced through Mormon Church History and practice — and because of that, I was unable to continue to associate myself with the LDS Church.
Yusuf talked of Joseph Smith’s “clearly checked past,” and the fact that there are “problems with the BoA and the BoM as though those facts are excusable. The fact is that the Church lies to and deceives its members and investigators every day of every month of every year. It actively works to cover-up the truth behind much of its history and many of its teachings. While the Mormon Church is a “religious” organization that claims to be Christian and professes to value truth, honesty and integrity, it plays very fast and loose with the truth. To me, that is highly hypocritical and not acceptable in the least. How can the Mormon Church attempt to teach people truthfulness and honesty when it follows neither. How can the Mormon Church hold out the 13th Article of Faith as actual practice? And in actuality, how can it hold out many of its Articles of Faith as actual teachings to which it actually adheres.
Yusuf also said, “I can easily recognize that Joseph Smith was an unparalleled ass at times, without trying to explain it away as anything other than the fact that he was a complete ass. I also have to conclude that he rose above what we might consider normal human experience at times as well.” this is obviously the premise of the book Rough Stone Rolling, but to me, being a Prophet of God and the Prophet of the Restoration as well as an adulterer, liar, con-artist, shyster, criminal, and unparalleled ass do not go together. It simply does not compute.
Also, for Yusuf to say that he recognizes that “the BoA is problematic from a genesis point of view, but I think the theology it contains is fairly deep and very interesting, and I am less interested in the origins, than in the application” is very odd. The BoA is the only place where Kolob is mentioned in church teachings. Since the papyri from which the BoA was “translated” was actually Egyptian funeral papers, it is obvious that Joseph Smith made up all that is contained in the BoA. So in essence Yusuf is saying that Joseph Smith created theology that is “fairly deep and interesting.” How is that acceptable or justifiable in the least? There are a lot of very good fiction writers out there who have written “fairly deep and very interesting” novels. How is this any different?
I’m at a loss to understand how obviously intelligent people like Yusuf Ibrahim can stay in the Mormon Church given the obvious “problems” with its doctrine, teachings and history. Perhaps my downfall is that I am intolerant of being lied to and deceived — and that I have such a “strong foundation of literal belief” (as Matt stated earlier in this comment section). To me, if something is based on lies, there can be no good come out of it — nor any “solace” obtained from it. As is taught in the Mormon Church, any organization built on a shaky foundation cannot stand. To me, that says it all.
I suppose in the end, I do not think the terms are as black and white as “lies, deceptions and contradictions”. I think, though fictional, Obi Wan Kenobe was wise when he told a troubled Luke Skywalker that “Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view”. Church History is obviously faith promoting, but I do not know of a religious history that is not. It is the nature of the exercise, to emphasize the good, downplay the bad, and promote the standard view, despite potential errors. I do not think that anyone is trying to lie, deceive, or contradict, rather I think the LDS Church is exactly what it is, a flawed organization that believes what it does in spite of the problems because this is what any organization, religious, political, or social, does in real life.
But is this unusual? I know Catholics who remain Catholic knowing many Popes were tremendously horrible people, that the Catholic Church is responsible for some significant horrors in history, and that there are problems with Catholic history and theology. Yet despite this, they find solace in the Church, so they remain. I do not see it any differently for a questioning Mormon. Truth told I like Mass, I have been more than a few times and I really wish there was more incense in LDS meetings, but I don’t think it will ever happen.
I enjoy Temple attendance. I enjoy Sacrament, sometimes. I enjoy my classes, sometimes. Occasionally I am bored to tears, or I am irritated by the lesson (anti-gay lessons for example) but I do not see walking away as the right answer. I find spiritual fulfillment in LDS teachings, in LDS liturgy (as it exists), and in aspects of the LDS path and the Gospel. I see no reason to believe that the LDS Church is the Gospel, I think the Gospel transcends the LDS Church. The Church is part of my religious life, certainly not the whole of it, but a part of it, and I find it works for me.
And for now, I can accept the warts of the Church despite the problems, because I do not think I was deliberately lied to or misled. I recognize that history is what you make of it, and this is not a black or white medium. I have no doubt that the 12 and First Presidency fully believe that Joseph Smith was everything they claim him to be. I think he was a difficult, and complex figure who had as many vices as he had virtues, and I do not think anyone alive, past, present, or future was any different. I believe they believe the LDS Scriptures to be everything they claim it to be.
I do not think anyone lied to me, any more than I believe that any history is pure as the driven snow.
Great awesome things here. I am very glad to peer your post. Thanks a lot and i’m looking ahead to contact you. Will you kindly drop me a mail?
It truly is realy fine posting, searching very interesting will probably be glad show and recomendate my friends Iam guaranteed they’ll be content read this posting